Ep 59: 6 Steps to Success with Sandro Forte

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Introduction

Dawn McGruer:

So, we are live and streaming across all of my channels. And, in this week’s episode of Dawn of a New Era, the podcast, we have special guest Sandro Forte. And, today’s podcast is about something that every single person will be familiar with, in some capacity. And, it’s going to be all centered around six ways to success, or six steps to success. And, Sandro and I have met. I was on Sandro’s podcast. You may have seen it on my channels. And again, we are quite aligned in our mission, and vision, and principles of what we believe in, in terms of business. Sandro has written a book, Dare To Be Different.

I really like the whole ethos of what you talk about in terms of being different, standing out from the crowd, because it resonates with what I talk about. Because, I am always talking about marketing, motivation, and mindset. And, I talk about it a lot, the fact that we want to be zigging when everyone else is zagging. And, I think we have this as a common kind of theme across what we both do. Now, give us an introduction in terms of your background, how you came to be sitting here today, and what your mission and vision is for the future.

Strengthened by adversity

Sandro Forte:

Well firstly, hi, Dawn. Lovely to see you again. I feel a bit of a fraud, to be honest, because I’ve listened to some of your guests and many of the people that you know, who’ve achieved some extraordinary things. And, I don’t think I have a CV that quite matches up. But nevertheless, I have been fortunate enough to travel to, I think, 84 different countries of the world, sharing a number of philosophies that have kind of helped me in life and business. You and I have a lot in common. We both suffered from adversity, particularly death in our families, and in our circle of close friends.

So, I guess, life properly started for me when I was nine years old. My father passed away from cancer. He was a very successful businessman. My mum was bankrupt in two years, having no contingency in place for looking after five children. And I think what we did, is we went through this process of understanding the best of life. We were quite wealthy family, we lived in a lovely big house, and had the holidays, and all the trappings of success, and then lost everything in a heartbeat, really. And then 13 years later on, by which time my mum had remarried a super guy by the name of Dave, who became really my confidant, my best friend, he was the person who dragged me, screaming, kicking through a levels and university got me involved in sport and all kinds of stuff. And I was presented with a very unique opportunity, which I’m sure we’ll discuss. And it was that moment that created a bit of an epiphany that crossroads, where I had a simple choice to make, I chose to take some action and my life completely changed.

And that really has shaped everything that happened since. So I guess to summarize the CV, the day job I work with high net worth individuals and business owners, helping them to achieve greater financial success. I have a podcast which kind of grew from conversations I was having with people I knew very well. I’ve raised 15 and a half million pounds for charity, which I’m very proud of. I’m allegedly a professional speaker by virtue of the fact that I get paid for it. And as you say, I’ve written a book and soon to be a second. So I think in summary, you could describe me as somebody who has a very low boredom threshold.

Dawn McGruer:

Well, I think we’re aligned on that one. So, I mean, at the moment I’m talking about putting the fun back into business and I think what you say about, obviously, how what happens to you in life makes a difference and it’s kind of how you carve things out. I mean, for me, one of the things that I did when I was 21, whether I was crazy or just, I don’t know, looking for something different, was I did my first book, Character Building, and it actually includes people, it was endorsed by Phillip Schofield.

So Nigel Hawthorne, if any of you remember him, he endorsed the book. He suddenly passed with cancer during it. And actually all the stories in there are about overcoming adversity. Exactly what you say, it’s every cloud has a silver lining and it does make a difference how you go into business and definitely my attitude. I became very much kind of a risk taker and living for the moment. What do you think, thinking about your six steps to success, what do you think one of the sort of ways that you live by has come from that background?

We are all guilty of overthinking

Sandro Forte:

I’ll kind of finish off the story now then since you’ve asked that question, Dawn. I think the thing that changed the shape of my life, the predetermined outcomes was this process that involves taking some kind of positive action. So, we are all guilty of overthinking things. And the two years when I joined the financial studies business at age of 21, no aspirations to do that, by the way, just needed to pay off my student overdraft. But I started working for a family friend. He was an IFA. And what I learned in those four years, working with him was how I didn’t want to be in business. And he was stereotypically kind of the product pusher, all the stuff that we hate about financial advisors really. But where that presented a massive challenge, it created an opportunity for me because what I did was built some amazing relationships with the clients who didn’t like him very much.

But at the same time, after two years of being in the business, I’m looking at my stepfather, Dave, who’s the breadwinner of the family now, every single day I’m looking him and that little voice and I are having a conversation. And what I talk about that a good voice I’m talking about that little imaginary person that sits on our shoulder and gives us a thousand reasons a day why we shouldn’t do something. And I procrastinated. I put off having a very awkward conversation with someone who I knew didn’t have very much money. And certainly if they did have any money to spare my mum and stepfather, weren’t going to spend it on life insurance.

But the story is not one of life insurance, it’s the story of me spending two years putting off to tomorrow, what I should have done today. And then December 1991, I eventually found the courage. I think I just got sick of making the same old excuses, had a conversation, I don’t remember at all what I said, but to my surprise, they said, “No, I would hate the thought of anything happening to me. But if it did, I know your mum would be back in the same position she was in all those years ago. So yeah, we should really try and put something into place.”

And he became my first self-generated client in the business after two years. And he became a client on the 8th of December 1991. And in the early part of February 1992. So just two months later, he too was diagnosed with cancer. It was a very aggressive form of stomach cancer and he was dead within four weeks. Now in those final moments, when I was sat by his bedside in the hospital, one of the last things he said, he looked me in the eye and he was holding my hand and he said, “Son, thank you for what you did for your family. I’m so proud of you.” And when I reflected on what he said to me in those final moments, I really focused on the word did.

In all my 31 years in business Dawn, every single successful person, and I guess we’ll define what success is, because it’s different things to different people. But, the one commonality amongst all, people who have achieved something extraordinary, it’s what they did, not what they said they would do. It’s not about the New Year’s resolution. It’s not about the excuses, it’s about what they… They got off their backside and took a step toward something, and they didn’t focus on the process or rather didn’t focus on the outcome, they focused on the process, controlling the controllables. And I learned a very, very important, obviously tragic, though the circumstances were, it’s a very important lesson in that moment.

And so everything that I guess I’ve done since then, and there’ve been lots of failures along the way has been taking a decision, because a decision is one thing, but turning it into some kind of outcome is something altogether different. So that would be my biggest lesson in life. It’s not about being bigger, better, faster, stronger, more intelligent, having a better product at a cheaper price. It’s about creating an experience for people, taking some positive action, and having a strong mindset along the way. And now I’ve just given you insight onto three of the six principles.

Dawn McGruer:

No, but this is it because honestly, I think success is relative. And one of the things I’ve been talking about today on a few lives is about you hear people talking about these six, seven figure businesses and things like that. And people are so hung up on the sort of planning around business. That they’re not focused on anything other than just achieve this, achieve this, but it’s the journey that goes with it, it’s the experience. And we all have to start thinking about living in that moment. I think one of the things that you talk about is this sort of planning for not just yourself, but planning for others. And I think it’s something that people are quite uncomfortable about because we don’t tend to talk about death and all the awful things that can happen. We just think it’s not going to happen to us. If you were to break down, then your sort of six steps to success, obviously we’ve said positive action. I totally agree with this is one of them. What would you say in detail sort of your second one would be and third?

You have to establish a brilliant mindset

Sandro Forte:

Well, for me, number one, Dawn, is his mindset. You’ve got to establish a brilliant mindset. And when I talk about mindset, a lot of people say, Well, is that positive mental attitude?” And the answer is no, we can all wake up in the morning and feel great about the day ahead. But the trouble is life gets in the way, things happen that derail us from that initial thought. So I’ve been to loads of conferences, and I know you have. You’re a brilliant speaker and you’ve heard some other good speakers, but I’ve also heard a lot of other speakers who purport to be motivational, and that’s great. I sit in an audience at nine o’clock by the time he or she is finished speaking, I feel amazing about myself, but by lunchtime, that feeling is dissipated because stuff gets in the way.

So when I talk about positive mindset, I’m talking about a deeply embedded DNA, something that, and I’ve heard you talk about in your podcast and in the presentations you’ve given, where a positive mindset become subconscious, like walking, talking, sleeping, riding bicycle, and so on. And for those people who say, “I can’t have a positive mindset because,” and then all the excuses come out, we are all fundamentally extraordinary people. Everyone on this planet is brilliant at a fundamental level. Why? Because putting aside physical disability and mental disability, the reality is we all perfected some of the hardest things that it’s possible to do, take walking as an example, we get shown a new technique, a new way of doing something that in our tiny little minds at the time we think, “Well, that’s much more effective way of doing something in the way we’ve done it before.”

And so you pick yourself up off the floor and you try this a thousand times and you’d fail 999 times. And then on the final attempt, you’d get it right. And then a new habit would be born now at its basic level. We do all of these things without really consciously being aware of them. I have a belief that you can train your subconscious mind in exactly the same way you taught it how to ride a bike or drive a motor vehicle. And I’ve a lovely little technique, which we may have time to talk about, may not. And what that does is it kind of eliminates what I call the discouragement club. The discouragement club are that group of people who, whenever you walk into an office or you see them on the street corner, in a coffee shop, and all they do is they spend their entire lives talking about all the things that are going wrong in their own world, right? And then never happy…

Dawn McGruer:

It’s the meet up and someone just goes into full war and peace. We all know people who do that and it just kills you mojo, doesn’t it?

Sandro Forte:

It does. And they’re never happier than if they’re 14 someone else’s success on that path through life. So that would be the first one. I think the second one would be understanding what a goal actually is. Now, I despair of the number of speakers who talk about smart goals. It’s really old fashioned, but people still believe in it. And for me, smart goals, I don’t understand how they work, because if you have a smart goal by definition, you have a goal that is realistic. Well, my experience, no one’s ever achieved anything extraordinary by being realistic.

And I’ll give you a good example. I was very fortunate to be chairing a, a group of people who do a one day, 24 hour fundraising event every year, the most they’ve ever raised as $130,000 it’s US-based company, which I’m proud to now be a board member of, and before this fundraising started, the team said, “As chair, Sandro, what’s your goal for the team going to be? 50 volunteers from around the world. What’s the goal going to be?” And I said, “It’s going to be $250,000.” And they went, “No, no, no, no, no, wait a minute, you can’t have $250,000. Cause that’s really unrealistic. And when you don’t achieve the goal, you’ll just demotivate everyone.” So I said, and I roll this phrase that all the time, Dawn, “People fail in life not because they aim too high and miss. People fail in life because they aim too low and hit that’s the reality.”

Dawn McGruer:

Do you know I think people get quite transfixed on the whole kind of business orientated, generic targets, like revenue, leads or these things rather than, one of the things I talk about a lot is having aspirational goals that feel truly achievable. They’re the bigger picture, the why. If you start your business, why do you want to do it? You don’t want to just do it to hit a revenue number. You did it because you wanted something bigger or a higher goal. Like freedom, flexibility, spending time with your family, doing whatever you want to do. So moving on then to number three, because I know that some people want to see if we’ve got time for getting through all six, which hopefully we will do. But obviously there was the activity that you talked about. I think maybe we can try and finish it with that.

Create an experience

Sandro Forte:

Yeah. So yeah, I think we should definitely finish on action activity. Number three, for me would be create an experience. So I’ll give you a great example of businesses that create great experiences: Apple, Starbucks, McDonald’s. With great respect to those brands, are they the best products in the world? Do they offer them at the cheapest price? The answer is no on both counts. We will have a different view on product and pricing. But the one thing that they do brilliantly well is they create an experience. So customers know that from the moment they walked through the metaphorical door to the moment they leave the metaphorical door, they know exactly what they’re going to get and that consistency engenders trust. So I think the question I have a lot of people is what are you doing? Whether you are a telephone sales person, whether you’re selling widgets, whether you are in a service-based industry or manufacturing, what are you doing to create that experience?

Become iconic

Sandro Forte:

Because as we know, Dawn today’s world, ever more competitive as it is, it’s much more about value than price. So Starbucks, not the best cup of coffee on the planet, but people will pay three pounds, 75 for a latte because they’re getting something more than the product. So it’s a wide reaching question. What is the experience you will bring in? And in my particular business, how do we compete against some of the really, really big companies that are super well resourced? We have to provide something that’s different. And that’s of course what prompted the book really. so that would be number three. Number four, not heard many people talk about this before, but it’s this whole idea about becoming iconic. And this will really resonate with you Dawn, in terms of what you do. The idea about having an iconic business, creates this business where people come to you, you don’t have to go to them.

So you become so well known for what you do, synonymous with excellence and quality and all these other things that people find you out. So when I talk about becoming iconic, I’m talking about three things, one is to develop a great personality, not necessarily your own personality, but the personality of the business. What does it look like? What does it stand for? How do you communicate? So developing the art of some form of communication in whatever way or means that you would do that. The second one would be education, which is kind of knowing your stuff really. If I can put it that way. And then the third and most important one, which is what you’re expert at is visibility. Because if you’re not visible in today’s world, you can have the best product on the planet, but people will never get to know about it. So what are you doing to make yourself as visible as possible? So that’s what I talk about when I talk about being iconic people coming to you, not the other way around. And those are the three steps that you have to follow, I suggest.

Dawn McGruer:

Yeah, definitely think the thing Is now is that people are, so I think, mixed up with what social media should be because the social media has grown. So have the platforms and now people are trying to dilute themselves across 97 platforms, show up consistently and losing a fighting battle. Because I think we need a social media shakeup. And one of the things I talk about a lot is about being seen and found quicker, and actually just focusing on the most powerful network and having a powerful network of people doesn’t mean like having 50,000, 5 million, or whatever, it’s a quality network. It could be 50 to 500 of the most amazing people that you want in your network. And I think people get so transfixed on just chasing the ideal client. A powerful network to me is having inspirational leaders, mentors, coaches, partners, people you can collaborate with. And having a community I think is the key.

So I love this idea of being iconic because I think a lot of people are tired and a lot of people are kind of in this churn of constant creation of content and then trying to post online and being iconic, but in your own niche with your powerful community. So it’s relative, isn’t it? It’s relative to what you actually want. So go on, hit us with number four, sorry, with number five, what’s our number five of our six steps to success?

Know the difference between success and failure

Sandro Forte:

So number five is one that I think all too often gets overlooked, but it’s really important. And I’m going to share this for the benefit of all those people who regularly make telephone calls and for them the outcome, the yes or the no, is the difference between success and failure. And I’m going to hopefully reposition for everyone who sees the outcome as the determining factor as to whether something is successful or not by simply suggesting that the yes or no does not reflect on your ability at all, because it’s the one part of the process you can’t control.

So if you’re a salesperson, for example, and you are being judged about whether or not somebody says, “Yes, let’s get a meeting in the diary?” or “Yes, I’ll buy that product.” Or “”No, I won’t.” That’s not what determines success or failure. what determines success or failure is the things that you can control. Pick up the telephone, have a conversation, ask for the order. Let’s put it in that simple term. If you do not do that first, in this example, three steps, then you failed. The bit that you can’t control as the yes or no. And yet what’s interesting Dawn is that everyone focuses on the bit they can’t control to determine whether they’ve been successful or not. That has no logic at all on any level. So by controlling the things that you can control yourself, and as long as you can tick the boxes and say, “Yes, I did all the things I can do.” To me, that’s a successful outcome.

The bit that somebody else is responsible for, well, that’s not determining factor in terms of successful outcomes. And I’m a great believer that if you follow the process and you do it consistently life is a revolving door. It has a way of giving back several times over what you do. But the reality is we say we do these things. We say we control the controllables, but we don’t. Most people who don’t achieve great success in life, and there’s two very important words that I use a lot, discipline and regret. And I ask people all the time, which of the two words, discipline and regret is painful? And it’s some people say discipline, some people say regret, but the reality of course is that both of them are painful, but here’s the guarantee I’d offer anyone listening today, If you don’t do the first one in life, you’re always going to get the second one by definition.

So I think if at the end of the day, we can look ourselves in the mirror and say, did we do all the things that we set out to do today? And we can say yes, on a consistent basis, success takes care of itself. It really does. What most people do, Dawn, is they just look back over their shoulder at some point in the future and just go “If only”, and then there are several dots after the “if only”. And that’s not where I ever want to be. So…

You can succeed even without talent

Dawn McGruer:

No, and this is it. You got to start somewhere. And it’s like, I don’t know. Even if you’re just sitting there thinking, “Should I take a step?” I mean, the thing is is if you take the step, something can happen. If you don’t, nothing will change. It will just be the same. And I think this is the exciting thing. When you think about business and you think about taking your business to the next level or doing something new, you’ve taken that chance. And every time you take a pun or you do something different, you learn from it. So I think it just evolves and it kind of spirals into kind of the new you. And I think every person is changing and it kind of comes back to all of these things, mindset, goal setting, experience, being iconic and controlling the other factors. And I said to you today happy Monday.

And this morning, honestly, it was just one of those days where you just think I want to go back to bed, but do you know what you have to kind of just refocus and reframe because those things were things I couldn’t control, that happened to me this morning. I won’t go into them, but wifi might have been one of them. And you just have to just switch it up and think, control what you can and move forward. And it just put you into a completely different sort of disposition. You just kind of see the fun side of life again and start kind of refocusing rather than the things that you can’t change. So go on what is going to be the sixth and final one to our steps to success?

Sandro Forte:

Well, I’m the living embodiment of somebody who has gone further in life, despite a lack of talent. So I am a great believer that you can have a distinct lack of talent, but still get as far as you want to go to in life if you just take positive action. I’m a doer, not a talker. The number of times I’ve been to meetings and I hear people at the end of it say, so let’s have another meeting to discuss the meeting that we’ve just had. And yes, I would introduce people to you and I’m going to do this for you. And it’s just cheap talk. It doesn’t add any value. It takes up more time. Whereas I met, okay, what are the next two or three action steps that we can take as a result of this meeting? And I will follow through every single time without fail.

So sometimes things don’t work out. Success is not easy, but it’s really simple. If you follow the steps, success, isn’t comfortable. If you read anybody’s book on success, they never talk about it being plain sailing. They never talk about the fact that everything they ever turned their hand to, they had a fantastically successful outcome. It just doesn’t work like that. You talk, I know in one of your podcasts, all about the fact that the great thing about failure, if you want to call it failure, the little roadblocks in life, they only have a finite timeframe. They don’t last forever. I think you refer to them as lasting for 24 hours. The next day’s a different day. I have something called a one, 100 rule one year from now a hundred percent of our circumstances will be different.

So the reality is, these things don’t last, but I’m a great believer that if you take positive action, having made a decision. Good example, people join the gym first, January, every year, along with all the New Year’s resolutions. I’m going to get fit. I’m going to do this by what I think the middle of January, 50% of those people have stopped going to the gym. And by the end of the month, it’s 75%. So, the reason why 3% of the world’s population employ the other 97% is because it’s those 3% who do all of the things that we’ve been talking about today. That is the reality, but what’s really encouraging, what should be encouraging, is we all have exactly the same set of choices to make. Question is what choice are we each prepared to make?

Dawn McGruer:

Yeah, absolutely. And I think the thing is is that when you fail it is painful. You can’t get past that fact, if you put your heart and soul into something and it doesn’t pan out how you wanted it, yeah. There’s going to hurt. And it really is. But it’s about getting up and dusting yourself down and thinking about what would happen if you hadn’t done it. What would you feel like then? You would have some form of regret or a feeling associated with it. But the thing is, is regret doesn’t really give you much. Whereas if you have some form of failure, if we call it that or something that just doesn’t pan out, then just think of all the magical lessons that you’ve taken from that and how that’s going to help you evolve for the future. So if we’ve got time, let’s have a look at the activity that you were talking about earlier, because I know a couple of people who are listening were keen to find out, so share with us the activity so we can follow along.

Sandro Forte:

So when we talk about activities, I mean, obviously activities take the form of many different parts of the process. So goodness, it’s difficult to know where to start. But I have, for example, a very, very simple diary system. It’s called the yellow box diary system. I won’t go into detail, but the one thing I will just mention, there are three activities that I focus on. And one of the things that I hear people talking a lot about is “I want to get better work-life balance. I don’t want to work harder, I want to work smarter.” There is a very, very simple way to help us with that. The three steps, the three activities: on, in, and me.

So let me break those down. First of all, on is the strategy, the strategic staff, where you are setting your goals, you are preparing a file, whatever it is you need for your next meeting. It’s the stuff. Let me call it stuff. It’s the stuff you need to do in order to get to step number two, which is the in activity. The in activity is you writing a book. You’re generating revenue from LinkedIn activity, me sitting in front of a client. It’s the stuff that generates revenue. It’s where we all want to spend as much time as possible. But if you’ve ever read a book by a guy called Rob Parsons, who’s brilliant at explaining and helping us understand the difference between success and failure. And in particular, how that relates to family and work life balance.

The third one is me. And me time is the sport, the time in the gym, it’s the meditation, the yoga, whatever it is we want to do for ourselves and our families. It’s the date with our significant other. It’s reading the bedtime story to the kids. But what too many people do is they overload their diary with the in stuff, because that’s what culture tells us we need to do. To be “successful” we must spend all our time in revenue generation mode. The problem is if you don’t have the strategy, you’re not going to be as effective in the in activity. And if you don’t have the me, well, loads of examples of people, who’ve got the me bit wrong and they end up with a very, very successful business, lots and lots of money, but spend most of their time alone. So as a general rule of thumb, I say 60% of your time in, 20% of your time on, and 20% of your time me. And if you can look back over your diary week by week and roughly have those percentages, you won’t go far wrong.

Dawn McGruer:

Yeah, I love that. It’s very similar. Everyone has their own little time blocking strategies and having time in your diary actually, where you do nothing, I think is one of the things I have where you have a carefree area. And you don’t put any of your personal appointments. You don’t put any work appointments. You just show up at that time and do nothing, or choose what you want to do at that time. And I think the thing is, is we’re constantly just rushing around trying to do stuff and I’ve seen it, we’ve come out of the pandemic, life got very simple in the pandemic, and we couldn’t go anywhere. People are busy, busy again, but really are we just being busy fools, packing her diaries, full of stuff that we don’t really need to be doing? So I love it.

So mindset, understanding what a goal is, experience, being iconic, controlling what you can and focusing on the stuff that you can change, and obviously having positive action. So making sure that we have some of these principles and activities. And I think one of the biggest takeaways is that, if you are having a bit of a down day or you’ve got a situation, how do you overcome that adversity? What’s a final thought on, if someone is kind of feeling a little bit jaded with life or business, what’s one of the things that you would say that, just to change ,that they could do something? A quick tip, maybe?

Sandro Forte:

Two things. One is philosophical, one’s an answer to your question. The first philosophical one is if you haven’t watched a film called Sliding Doors, watch it. It’s a brilliant film with Gwyneth Paltrow where she makes a decision to run for an underground train in America, misses the train and the film pans through her life over the next few months based on her missing the train, but then the scene reruns and she just catches the train and then running in parallel, the story of the next few months unfolds based on the fact she did catch the train. So my point here, philosophically is it doesn’t actually matter whether you “succeed” or fail at anything because whatever you do, you are going to go down a different path. So there is always a positive journey to look forward to, it doesn’t just stop all of a sudden.

But I guess the answer to your question really is resetting it, going back to the basics, everybody, without exception, has things that work. Maybe it’s reconnecting with a family member or a friend or undertaking some kind of activity that puts a smile on your face. And sometimes it’s okay to have a really, really lousy day. I’ve had loads of those. But just taking yourself out of the process for a moment, resetting by doing something you’re passionate about, enjoy a glass of wine, meditate, watch your favorite TV program, reconnect with somebody you love dearly, whatever it is, it just breaks that cycle. And then we start the process. That 99.9 times out of a hundred will work.

Dawn McGruer:

So if people who are listening today want to come and find you, what is your preferred network of choice? Where are they going to find you?

Sandro Forte:

You want me to say LinkedIn, don’t you, Dawn?

Dawn McGruer:

Well, LinkedIn’s always going to be my favorite place of hangout but I don’t mind.

Sandro Forte:

I think most people find more on LinkedIn about me. I mean, yes, I have an Instagram account and a Twitter account and Facebook. But those are all cause of my son cause I’m an old dinosaur and I don’t know anything about social media. So LinkedIn would definitely be the right place to connect with me just because I have the podcast and the book and the business, always five things that I’ve mentioned that the philanthropy and everything else that I do most of it you’ll find on, on LinkedIn.

Dawn McGruer:

Brilliant. Oh, well thank you for coming on today’s Dawn of a New Era podcast and yeah, if you’ve got any questions, you can comment obviously in feed, but go and check out Dawn of a New Era and you can listen to the episode again and chart down some of those key tips. So enjoy guys. And thanks again, Sandro for being a marvelous guest as usual.

Sandro Forte:

Thank you, Dawn. Thank you.

 

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